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[PNN] Over the past few decades, you have been at the forefront of Wicca, and have produced many comprehensive works on the subject. This latest book, Progressive Witchcraft, is more about personal spirituality than Wicca. What prompted you to write it?

[JFGB] What prompted us was that, over the last 10 years we have seen books being published on Wicca and witchcraft which have not discussed spirituality at all; it also came out of our experiental Inner Mysteries Intensives - much of the material for the book comes from our experiences in dealing with individuals in these workshops!

Most people come into witchcraft not because of spellcraft or magic, but because they are on a quest to discover the roots of their own spirituality; this was certainly true of ourselves and of those of our generation, and we believe it is still true for the new generation that is coming up within witchcraft. We do not believe it is possible to divorce magic and spirituality; 'the first thing that magic changes is the self'. Therefore to divorce witchcraft from the manifestations of spirit in our lives, the many gods and goddesses, is impossible. Therefore not just Wicca, but also witchcraft in general is a mystery tradition, as it will cause spiritual change, the mysteries, to occur in anyone who practises it. Therefore even someone who just starts doing a few spells will eventually find themselves on the spiritual path of the mysteries regardless of whether they have been traditionally initiated or not. True Spiritual Initiation is ultimately from spirit not an individual from a specific tradition or lineage.

This means that solitaries and even self-initiates have the right to be recognised by others when they are on this path. What becomes important is not lineage but training be it self or within a group.

Gavin Bone and Janet Farrar (Photo courtesy of Gavin Bone)

[PNN] Who can benefit from this book? Is it neccessary to have a thorough grounding in Wicca to appreciate it?

[JFGB] This book was written for a wide audience; from those just beginning to those who have been practising many years. Even we are still learning, after all and we will still continue to learn even after our next incarnation! We wanted to make the book unique to what has already been published out there - there are a lot of books out there just regurgitating the same information.

[PNN] As Wicca has expanded and spread out across the world, many new traditions have sprung up. This may be a good thing in many ways, but can lead to confusion for the newcomer. Elemental pacts, correspondences, herbology, the rede, and reincarnation are some of the most frequently encountered aspects of a tradition. What do you believe are the most important principles that a student should be exposed to?

[JFGB] We strongly believe that diversity is a good thing - the more 'traditions' the better! Nature, therefore the Goddess, loves diversity. It is essential to evolution, change and growth, particularly spiritual growth. The most important principle is that the individual witch can connect to spirit directly - to quote Doreen Valiente's Charge of the Goddess 'if you cannot find me within thee, you will never find me without'! For the newcomer this is the first thing to bear in mind, everything else is directed at allowing this connection: The Wheel of the Year, the balancing of the Elements within, and ritual practise are all tools to allow this connection. The tool may be different according to each tradition but they must all ultimately serve the same purpose, connection with Spirit; God/Goddess. Magic can be seen as a way of serving deity, by assisting it to create a better world, by healing and mending it in some form, individually and/or collectively.

[PNN] In the last five years we have lost many notable contributors to the growth and understanding of the craft. Doreen Valiente, Leo Louis Martello, Jessie Wicker Bell, Ellen Cannon Reed and of course Stewart Farrar, to name a few. With the passing of these people, is there a danger that some of the original meaning and intent of Wicca may be lost, or do you see in the latest generation of witches some good leaders who clearly 'get it'?

[JFGB] The most important thing about most of those that you have mentioned is of course, that they were not dogmatic! Very few realise that Doreen Valiente, although she wrote most of the prose work was not a follower of any specific tradition and before her death she had been initiated into at least three of them. Yes, we do have new leaders coming up within Wicca and witchcraft - in fact probably more than we have had in the past. In the past our leaders were more noticeable as there were so few, we also tended to pedestal them - a dangerous trend which resulted in 'the cult of personality' occurring in Wicca. We are pleased to say that those days are now thankfully over. Our new 'leaders' are there from merit not because they make the loudest noise, and they aren't necessarily writers; we would point to Fritz and Wren Jung of Witches Voice as a good example - their contribution to witchcraft is of immense importance and THEY GET IT! They have understood the importance of spirituality over ego!

[PNN] Any religion, as it evolves, runs the risk of becoming dogmatic. Have you seen that with Wicca, and if so, do you think Progressive Witchcraft could help erase some of this?

[JFGB] Progressive Witchcraft is NOT A TRADITION. This is the first point we must make! It is a descriptive term of a trend we have noticed within witchcraft over the last 10 years. We have seen Wicca become dogmatic in some areas. This is because some have developed a retiscence to question their origins or even their methods of practise. For us Progressive Witchcraft is about questioning, particularly WHY? Why did our past 'leaders' do things the way they did? Why are we practising ritual the way we are? And why is there a witchcraft revival at this time in history? All we are asking people to do in the book is to ask why? If afterwards they wish to continue the way they have in their tradition then thats fine! What is important is the asking of the question. We are also trying to provide those in witchcraft with some new (or even old) tools to help them on their spiritual and ritual path. What they make out of them is up to them, but it is important that as witches we also 'learn how the engine works' as well as 'knowing how to drive the car'.

[PNN] You're currently on tour in Australia and New Zealand, and have spent a lot of time in the US as well as the UK. How would you say these countries compare with one other, regarding their attitude to Wicca? Does any one stand out as being more tolerant and accepting?

[JFGB] We've been lucky, we've managed to travel and see what people do around the world. It never ceases to surprise us how so many wiccans think that they are practising the same way as in other countries when they are in fact working very differently - well, that's environmental adaption for you! They all have their 'pro's and con's' when it comes to tolerance. New Zealand, where we at present, has been the most interesting. At the New Zealand Pagan Festival there was actually a free-food kitchen put up by the local baptists! They were welcomed by the pagan community here, and there was no attempt at prosletyzing at each other during the whole weekend. We actually sat down, conversed about spiritual matters and ate with them!

[PNN] What's next for you both? Any new projects on the horizon?

[JFGB] There's a couple of projects on the horizon; they center around expanding some of the chapters of Progressive Witchcraft.